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Andy Bunting's avatar

Thanks Ray! Excellent topic indeed.

I've always been sceptical about organised religions, due to their control aspect. In all of the control guises. As such & growing up in Africa. I was exposed to animism at a very early age. Through our African house & garden helpers. Animism embraces the concept of everything having a spirit. Every spirit is & always has been inter connected. Here my own personal opinion. I trust the foreword, disclaimer, in my piece, is accepted in good faith, good spirit & good heart; for all of us!

https://andybunting.substack.com/p/earth-mother

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BDev's avatar

Traditional religions exist to attempt to tame wild humans. To get some degree of control over their wildness, bloodthirstyness and independence. They have somewhat succeeded on all counts, and continue to do so for a large % of the population.

Those who have evolved themselves enough so that they no longer need the shackles of the fear of god to keep them in line have had enough of the conflicted stories that comes along with traditional religions. Many have evolved their personal spirituality enough to not need any god intermediaries, with their limited understandings and their propaganda.

Such people have likewise evolved their personal and social lives enough to not need any human 'gods' (govt/authorities), now clearly seeing the useless, obstructing and deadly character of such institutions.

Earth, for humans, is a kindergarten planet. Many of us have graduated from kindergarten, and its time to move on. We'd like for the rest of humanity to quickly graduate, too. But that's not going to happen. Earth is supposed to be a kindergarten planet for relatively young souls. Thus, the planet cannot be changed, for it is doing its job perfectly well.

Your ultimate religion is the one you discover for yourself. Remember, no one in the bible had a bible. Nature is the best place to begin your search.

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Roger's avatar

In all my years I encountered one person that I could trust, my wife.

I was always searching for a special friend that would give me the

knowledge that I longed for.Meanwhile or until then.i would read

as much as I could find in the libraries and book stores,thrift shops,

always alone and wondering. One day my wife read about an

invitation to a revelation seminar that included her favorite subject,

science. She went to the meeting by herself and enjoyed the

program.She shared her experience and I decided to join her for

protection if the group turned out to be a cult. We didn't realize our

true condition. We were both barely coping. We had never mentioned

the word God at any time and here we were entering a church. The

program had already started and the Evangelist was reading about

a Savior who died in order to remove sin from the universe. As soon

as I heard this I connected with The Friend that I had been searching

for all of my life. I immediately felt for the first time a love that

permeated my whole being. My search was over. It turned out that

this group was actually a cult which we discovered much later.

We were asked to leave for asking too many questions that they

we're not able to answer.

My wife went to a religious book store and purchased all the

material that I needed to learn the Bible.That was almost fifty

years ago. I could write books on our journey with God Who

has led us into a endless Life.. We stayed by ourselves

and are living a simple life without any T.V..radio or any

distractions. We follow a regime of natural medicine and prayer.

All we desire is a closer walk with A Wonderful Creator.

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Lynley Hocking's avatar

‘To argue that God exists is to deny him’

💎🙏❤️

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Neal Terrance's avatar

Well Ray you said you’d set up a religion philosophical chat after the rant between me and ol’ renate and it’s great that you did so.

After reading some of the, hmm I guess new age or hindu buddha cosmic gaia stuff written by renate and a few others, it would seem not many want to speak on YHWH and our Father God and our Lord and Saviour Jesus of the Bible.

Some want to re-direct the discussion topic to the wrong name of Christ our Savior instead of what is important and true of God / Christ.

Anyway I’m glad you set this up.

As I know the true wisdom and understanding of Renate will be stirred up to make his blood boil as few other topics can, so some serious Biblical talk is more necessary today than anything to do with

C 19 or death shots. Too late now, that’s a done deal as are your other on target discussions of death increasing weapons of silent destruction. It is all foretold. But understanding it all and dealing with it is also Biblical and foretold.

Biblical literacy is almost nonexistent today. Let’s get started.

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2FollowHim's avatar

If you look in Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, the name for the Lord is Yehoshua which completely tells us Who He is:

The Eternal Present (Yeho) is Salvation. Our Lord is King of Kings, ALL judgement given to Him.

People need to 'see it', and only God can really draw or show.

The biggest commandment of iesous (Greek) is

'Love one another'.

Not everyone, obvious to see, is called to receive Christ.

And not even if offered, do ALL offered receive Him.

My thankfulness? That God is perfect, perfectly just.

I can trust God. With everyone.

And hopefully show the fruit wherever possible.

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2FollowHim's avatar

Isaiah, Jeremiah. And more. Jonah was minor. But he went

'by appearance, remember? Not faith in God.

Today we don't have so much.

School kills the spirit.

Children don't need school.

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Amy thompson's avatar

I think humanity gets too distracted by labels. I once heard of an example, how could you describe electricity to humans before it’s discovery. God is a being and we use the term Him because it is a familiar label. We may be made in His image but we are lesser beings. I see the trouble humanity gets into is when we try to be God like. We are currently, teetering on extinction. The Elon Musks, Noah Harari, the idiots that think you can somehow download your subconscious. They are all trying to be God like. Unfortunately for them they think they can side step judgement. Arrogance is their sin. Judgement comes for us all. Humility is a virtue for a reason.

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kaal's avatar

As we are in the end of days perhaps we can move ourselves and others along the path to faith in Christ. yt channel easy mind video Lords prayer in aramaic chant. totally beautiful. pretty good yt channel harp for the Lord. video Spirit and the Bride.

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Nefahotep's avatar

For purposes of discussion; this excerpt from my article Individualized Sovereignty could serve as a good way to describe the experience of "God," in one's own life.

My sense is that any experience related to God is really related to Being.

"The condition of the sovereign “being” is a projection of the one-self into a physical birth; it is experienced by and for the sacred self. Human existence is a product of this sovereign experience. The true nature of being is formless, yet it is all there ever was, or could be. All physical forms are caused by a formless reality that is standing behind it. Temporarily participating in this experience called “human,” each experience of being are a focal point of infinite awareness. This makes each human being sovereign because the experience is observed from the vantage point of the Eternal Self; clothed in the ideation of Individual Hood. The Eternal “I,” True Being; that is both The Observer and The Observed, is One coming from Oneness. To stand within and observe the One in its myriad forms of Life; within the expression of Being, Consciousness, and Bliss. The fastest route to realization of this truth is Love. Our whole basis for Identity should be that of the formless nature of Consciousness; not human labels, or status based on appearances, since these are always transitory."

Religion is an Institution created by Elites to convince everyone that there is an inherent Arbitrary Hierarchy that creates "Exclusivity," to access God. This has always been a method of psychological manipulation. Religion was created by calcifying the inspirations that were original to Spiritual Experiences of individual seers and teachers. This resulted in "Dogma." Reading original ancient language and picking up the symbolism without the clerical "interpretations" helps a lot in seeing this.

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kaal's avatar

I would prefer the orthodox saints as examples of holiness.

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kaal's avatar

And do you love? Or do you love yourself and love feelings you may have for another? Love is sacrifice I think.

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Nefahotep's avatar

sacrifice can be inserted into many meanings. Some say that it is "sacrifice" to have kids, for example.

Love is the realization through reflection that we don't exist as "Separate Beings," is Sat / Chit / Ananda [Being / Consciousness / Bliss]

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kaal's avatar

humans will always love what is for themselves unless they are willing to sacrifice what they love or themself. i dont get the new age suff. is it experience or knowledge?

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Nefahotep's avatar

It's not new age.

Perspectives I express are infact experience based. As a Yogin, I have also studied ancient writings in Sanskrit and Egyptian language.

I am most guided by Upanishads.

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kaal's avatar

experience based by study? knowledge or virtue? capable of the beatitudes?

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kaal's avatar

read fr tom hopko orthodox theologian. he says we dont exist as separate beings.

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kaal's avatar

how do sacrifice and this "bliss" relate?

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Nefahotep's avatar

Sacrifice your sense of duality, you can experience bliss. Sacrifice the concept of superiority and inferiority. Sacrifice separateness. Sacrifice misery.

See your experiences with equal mindedness, there are many things that can be jettisoned.

The less baggage we are attached to..... the more we realize "being," and therefore "bliss."

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kaal's avatar

and how are you sacrificing CONCEPTS? yes we should not be attatched to this world or anything in it. because it causes sin selfishness self. sacrifice the world when you sacrifice yourself . like Jesus Christ.

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Nefahotep's avatar

Being attached to this world is not the point. Concepts are not the point either. Action in life is a living dynamic, it should be taken up and performed as your Sva Dharma, without attachments.

The world around us will reflect back to us what we create in it. We each live in the world that we create. From the vantage point of the inner Self, there is not One World with 8 billion people in it; there is One Existence, with 8 Billion Worlds in it. Individual Self is a focal point of attention within infinite awareness.

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kaal's avatar

your mind is part of the earth? mind that longs for wisdom beauty goodness truth and love?

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2FollowHim's avatar

My favorite author for Christianity was C.S. Lewis.

Screwtape letters, Mere Christianity.

I'm a believer there because I love freedom.

To follow Him, I've got to TOTALLY approve, agree with, LIKE the leader.

I found it all in Yehoshua, which means 'The Eternal Present is Salvation '. Jesus is invented (1640 a.d.). Iesous is the Greek,

He saves.

He saved me.

May I ask Ray if you'd let folks talk about 'confronting'?, dealing with

tyranny? What does 'do not consent' look like if environmental 'police' come, for example?

Haven't yet prayed, meditated on it?

Btw? Years ago, at the airport, US!! border crossing, we almost 'disappeared' forever. So, it's real.

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Ray Horvath, "The Source" :)'s avatar

You might also appreciate Chesterton. :)

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2FollowHim's avatar

Yes. C,S. Lewis 'made sense' to me. Then, true to worldly form, in 1640 a.d., they change the name of Yehoshua to a MEANINGLESS name!!

Hope I don't offend too much? But I'm FE. Where there's UP and down. Where the 'science', (measurements) are.

The name 'Jesus' is another lie.

The concept of 'hell' is not in the bible.

In this oppressive, tyrannical world, where SAYING anything can be bad, I sure love the nature of God and 'escape'

this dark realm sometimes.

In God, our STEPS are ordered, so most 'meetings'

are 'meant to be'.

I'm sure it often goes that way.

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E Lye's avatar

It must be frightening to be a biblical prophet. All of a sudden you get a mysterious revelation. What do you do with it?

In my case, I hide it in plain sight. I can explain where Heaven is. I can explain the Trinitarian God. If you are interested, I can show you where. Why do I hide it? In my country, such thoughts can you get you into hot soup . . . very hot soup.

Anyway, I took offence at some atheist on Youtube mocking God for allowing cholera to exist. So I penned this{sorry, that link is stuck is a PC that would not power on) - - -

10:38 30/12/2022

16:20 30/12/2022 revised.

17:07 30/12/2022

10:51 31/12/2022

11:45 06/01/2023

In Bruce Almighty, God goes on holiday and appoints

someone to look after the shop.

Thanks to Hollywood for introducing this concept.

It makes the following essay so much shorter.

I often wonder what I would do if God had chosen

me instead.

I have a fertiliser list that includes Pope

Francis, Fauci, Tedros, Biden, Justin, Merkel,

Jacinda, Monsanto.

Should I forgive them? no, No, NO! ... but ...

In my infinite mercy, I will treat this life as

a test run and not count their sins. I will give

them a second chance but under certain conditions.

This is why I allow Cholera to exist if you must

question.

The male in this life shall be born female in round 2.

Ditto for rich/poor. Developed/backward countries.

Rapists/comfort women. I leave it as an exercise

for for the reader to extend this list. I will

naturally appoint some angel to handle this.

Two if necessary.

History will repeat itself right?

Not if I declare that everybody will reach

puberty and when that happens, everybody

will dream of their past life

in vignettes for one whole year. But what about

the intellectuals who are now born retarded?

Fair question.

Am I not infinitely merciful? Slow to anger,

rich in mercy ... that sort of thing?

I have a reputation to maintain.

I shall also give them a free pass this time.

Drat Abraham and his plea for Sodom. Did

this story come from Persia too?

Have you considered that God introduced

those concepts one at a time before

consolidating them? Don't celebrities

wear disguises to avoid the Paparazzi?

I don't believe in masking but I still put

it on to blend in.

Raiders Of The Lost Ark fulfilled

Zechariah 14:12-19. Dude, you got pwned.

But the third round is final and absolute.

The warmongers shall face my wrath. But I am

human. I need suggestions. Slowly lowered into

a wood chipper? Daily Alabama Hotpockets?

WARNING - DO NOT google that term.

It is my 12th commandment. I have spoken.

It is not negotiable.

Go on. I dare you to defy me.

Mock me? Make fun of me?

We shall see.

I believe God exists.

There are too many

riddles in this universe that science cannot

explain.

Godel's Incompleteness Theorems

prove that mathematics is man-made. Do you

understand the Banach-Tarski Paradox?

Cosmologists tout Dark Matter and Dark Energy.

Why don't you mock them as well? Which Hubble

constant do they use?

The proton is "round-ish" and yet there are

supposed to be 3 quarks whizzing about.

If I give you 3 marbles, make me a sphere.

How does each particle solve its

own 3-body problem in real time and

consistently?

If you want to bug a physicist, ask them to

explain the Fine Structure Constant or

is it Fine Structure Variable?

Show me a magnetic monopole. Isn't the Big Bang

supposed to create those?

Read The Epigenetics Revolution by Nessa Carey.

Can evolution come up with those mechanisms by

pure chance? Histones. Methyl groups. microRNA.

Like Infinite Monkeys banging at typewriters

and producing a Shakespeare play.

Give me a break,

I explain the Trinitarian God in PART3 of

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhrRUM5t_sI

or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1RxAT3IdjI

You choir makes up your audience ... is this

not confirmation bias?

I only have one piece of evidence to assert the

existence and divinity of Jesus Christ.

His 12 disciples, who witnessed his works, all

died gruesome deaths WITHOUT a single one

recanting. Judas alone escaped the

gruesome bit.

Would you recant if they started pulling

your fingernails out? Or pulling out your

teeth. Or cutting your fingers segment by

segment with bolt cutters? Does this not

prove that Satan exists? How about tossing

babies up in the air as targets for bayonet

practice? Good, clean family fun right?

Would you pray to God then? OK, ok.

I respect your choice. I don't exist.

So what will you do then?

Do you call upon BlackAdam/JBiden/JBauer/JBourne/JBond?

Be my guest. You have one phone call.

Oh, by the way as they remove the still

alive digit-less, toe-less body from the

comfy chair and strap you in, please don't

say "Oh, my God!" because that would be

cheating.

For the rest of you, how certain are you

that you are not already in round 3? I

might have fibbed a little about

those warning dreams. My bad.

Oh, I also never said that everybody

enters into each round at the same

time. Don't script writers like to

add a little twist?

I think you should pray that God returns

from his vacation sooner rather than later.

I suck at being God. I think all of you

would agree.

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2FollowHim's avatar

Prophets WERE Prophets, their 'calling'? Who they WERE?

Their 'fabric', DNA?

Scripture says 'God IS LOVE(Agape)', but WE must respond

to that love. And it's pretty 'synchronized'.

Years ago, I was Christian, but 'got busy', and one evening,

at the computer, I 'spiritually' looked, and, 'oh, no!',

the Holy Spirit was gone!

I instantly prayed, and just as instantly, the Holy Spirit

came back. Never let that happen again.

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E Lye's avatar

I don't think any of the biblical prophets went to prophet school and then graduated Magnum Cum Laude before plying their "trade". My take is that they didn't want the job. Jonah comes to mind. Glad you got your Mojo back. Now what are you going to accomplish with it? I think mine is a passing shower as it should be. Sacred, profound, insightful. Not something to be squeezed out daily like a particularly nasty turd. If everybody just "prosper thy neighbour", the world would not be in this nasty mess. 13th commandment?

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kaal's avatar

That quote by paul tillich- God the father is being itself beyond essence and existence, But Christ is emmanuelle [sorry bout spelling this is new to me} meaning God with us. Since the schism the WEST has used rationalism to understand christianity and essentially lost the truth of it. see father seraphim rose analysis of history called i think orthodox survival course. orthodoxy is the true ancient christianity and he has helped me. Basically its not with the mind rationalism or mental processes that one understands christianity.

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2FollowHim's avatar

Iesous (the Lord) is called 'the light'. No man is the light.

We need spiritual light.

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kaal's avatar

Yes. humility to see ourselves as we really are. self sufficient will ful prideful sinful disobedient wanting this world and what we want period. and hard of heart.

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2FollowHim's avatar

If 'called'.

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LC's avatar

Amen! Elected, even 🙌🏽

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kaal's avatar

you will always lack and long for the divine- which is not the earth.

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kaal's avatar

your saying longing should be avoided and earth satisfies your need to belong???

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kaal's avatar

the earth will give you wholeness??

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kaal's avatar

You are part of the earth and belong? thats it?

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jacquelyn sauriol's avatar

Trees and plants. They have been here for billions more years than us, so they are actually 'smarter' and I treat them as elder brothers and sisters. Imagine you could not move around quickly, and had to get everything you need from your immediate surroundings; plants and trees live that way, and we would do better to emulate and learn about them in as many ways as possible. Stephen Buhners books are as bibles to me, (esp. Herbal Antibiotics and Herbal AntiVirals both updated for C19). Knowledgable herbalists are my prophets and teachers, the plants and trees themselves like family; Burdock root tea (with quercitin and inulin, and many constituents we haven't bothered to assess) got me though a 'mystery wasting illness' late 2019. I drank a pint a day for nearly 40 days, and took no other medicines.

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Nefahotep's avatar

We may be like minded here,

Stephen Buhners books are awesome, I brew ancient ale recipes like Gruit Ale. I learned a lot from Buhner. "Sacred and Herbal Healing Beers." Once you have filled your drinking horn with a Gruit Ale, you'll never go back to "Hopped" Beer.

Isn't it amazing how many things that occur in Natural Conditions can have Healing properties?

Isn't it amazing how many things that are created in a Lab under Pharmaceutical Conditions can have Lethal properties?

In addition to what we can get from Herbs; Bees can teach us a lot too. Some of the most ancient medicine was based off of Pollen, Raw Honey and Bee venom.

----- Cheers

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jacquelyn sauriol's avatar

have you read Royal Jelly by Roald Dahl? Clazy story. Bees, so maligned, like us. By us. Bees. And all the other insect pollinators, so many little flying things. More around this place since the plantings have got more natural and complex. Also, its nice to leave water out for insects, in a little dish with some rocks so they can drink easily. And to freshen it up frequently. Its a chore, but has payback....so far i just keep that and a birdbath clean, the crows like to take baths. They are big!

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jacquelyn sauriol's avatar

Rock on reante, yes the stones too being so...resolute, and so many different kinds of stone, like with plants and people. They make the places for the plants to be, the soil, the ocean sand or the sharp sands, so many colors...what we are made of....

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Pamela Raditsch's avatar

Speaking of optimization, there are all the useful homeopathic remedies - energy medicine - many specifically made out of rocks/minerals.

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jacquelyn sauriol's avatar

I always know when it's Thursday, because our dog is a shaking mess, due to the garbage trucks and their air brakes, which she hears long before they arrive up to early afternoon. Only after that can she even eat (dog) breakfast, before she is too stressed. I was told that when she was a puppy she was confined in a kennel near where the sound of garbage trucks was very loud, and she couldn't get away. Such traumas when young can be so long lasting, as we (mostly) all know...best

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kaal's avatar

millions of christians in russia defied the state church chose persecution and martyrdom. many miracles of faith and God unseen in the west that did not take away the suffering and death.

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jacquelyn sauriol's avatar

at the beach, my neck always gets to hurtin....cuz I am looking for shells and rocks...

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jacquelyn sauriol's avatar

yes, indeed, at least I have learned to keep an eye on the surf as well around the ocean....found so many petosky stones along a lake near Lake Michigan.....called Douglas Lake.

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Dee Dee's avatar

God is my concience and is why

I ultimately refused the vaccine. My Priest said, "it is unwise to place one's will over one's conscience".

I respect other people too. We have been given free will. Sometimes I am attacked by Christians for not being judgemental, but I find trying to lead by example, if possible, is good.

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Tsipora Pereira's avatar

Welcome to the Show.

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2FollowHim's avatar

Hi Elizabeth! Ray 'knows' his audience; rather mature folk that often really suffered through that scamdemic. So I saw they're patient, understanding. Nice work, Ray.

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Ray Horvath, "The Source" :)'s avatar

Certainly not, which is why I said it was what a few people requested, but I also emphasized I would not be part of it. :)

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